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April 17 2008 » News Clippings » CBC Daybreak North

CBC Radio: Daybreak’s Russell Bowers interviews SWCC’s Shannon McPhail

Verbatim Transcript
CBC-FM 91.5 Radio One
Daybreak North
April 17, 2008
7:16 am
Host Russell Bowers interviewing Shannon McPhail. Executive Director, Skeena Watershed Conservation Coalition
BOWERS: The Minerals North conference is in full-steam-ahead mode in Smithers over the next couple of days. Mining experts, companies, and politicians are discussing the future of the industry in the North. There is another issue bubbling below the surface, though: Coal Bed Methane. Since 2004, Shell Canada has been working to tap into vast amounts of Coal Bed Methane in the Klappan Valley. But some say that the project is moving too fast, and that includes Shannon McPhail. She is the Executive Director of the Skeena Watershed Conservation Coalition, and she is on the line with me this morning. Good morning, Shannon.

McPHAIL: Good morning.

BOWERS: What is it about this exploration that is moving too quickly for you?

McPHAIL: Well, there’s three reasons, actually. First, is the place that it is being proposed in, and that’s the Sacred Headwaters, also known as the Klappan. This is the birthplace of three of Canada’s greatest wild salmon rivers. And the Stikine, Skeena, and the Nass are all born from this one valley. It’s – it’s also that Coal Bed Methane, as an industry, is a very high-risk industry: it has a very poor track record, offers very little employment. There is no environmental assessment; there is no long-term development plan. And basically the third reason is that there is very, very low benefit for the community, very short-term, very low short-term economic benefits, even less long-term benefit. So we are really asking the community to – to make an investment without ever garnering a return on that investment. So the first thing I would like to point out, though, is that there is a very big difference between Coal Bed Methane and mining.

BOWERS: How is that?

McPHAIL: Mining offers – tends to offer – a lot more jobs. Coal Bed Methane offers much less employment. Mining goes through a rigorous government environmental assessment process; Coal Bed Methane does not. There’s just – there’s quite a few reasons. It is a completely different industry. Mining is more minerals focused, where Coal Bed Methane is extracting an unconventional gas, and it is so-called because of the extraction methods that it uses. And we just want to make sure that people know – especially coming to Minerals North. Minerals North is definitely about sound development, and that is something that we most certainly support. And Coal Bed Methane just isn’t an example of sound development.

BOWERS: Well, let me ask you about – I mean if a company is – in this case it looks like it’s Shell that wants to come in and drill for Coal Bed Methane. Are you suggesting that they can just come in, set up – set up the drills, and not have any accountability to anyone?

McPHAIL: Well, there’s a different – there is a difference in the regulatory regime. The mining industry is regulated by Ministry of Environment, Ministry of Transportation, Forests, Ministry of Energy and Mines, etc. Where the oil and gas, or Coal Bed Methane, is regulated only by the Oil and Gas Commission. And there – there are some concerns about the Oil and Gas Commission, being that 1) it is 100% funded by the oil and gas industry. So it kinda like the fox watching the henhouse. Secondly, the oil and gas industry – or the Oil and Gas Commission – has a nasty track record for compliance and enforcement. In 2005, a private audit was done, and it discovered that 73% of the sites that were inspected were contaminated. And just over 3,000 site inspections revealed almost 6,000 infractions. So to have the Oil and Gas Commission being the regulator in these wild salmon watersheds that this economy is so dependent on doesn’t offer me much comfort.

BNOWERS: And the mining industry has a spotless record?

McPHAIL: No, I am not saying that the mining industry has a spotless record, but they are definitely much stronger regulated [sic]. And there’s a lot more ministries involved. What has happened is that in order to streamline the regulatory regime for the oil and gas community, the Oil and Gas Commission was formed. And now they administer all the acts for ministries that once held these acts for accountability, such as the Environment Act, the Water Act, the Fisheries Act, etc. So you are not going to the ministries that know these processes.

BOWERS: Now, this area that we are talking about is – the name that is being thrown right now is the Sacred Headwaters. But from what I understand there has already been a lot of drilling and exploration that has happened in this area, especially in the 1970s. How pristine is this area, really?

McPHAIL: Well, in the 1970s, the BC Rail grade came through and they put a road in – not a road, a grade for the tracks to be laid down. And then that project was later abandoned. There was some drilling done in the seventies and eighties, but basically this area is untouched with the exception of this rail grade. But the rail grade has really been dilapidated; there’s a lot of problems with that. And it just – Coal Bed Methane potentially really, really harms the investment climate for this area. Y’know, it takes away from well-planned mining activities and starts to paint the entire industry with the same brush. And that is something that we certainly don’t want to have happen.

BOWERS: From what we understand – we are trying to get Shell Canada on to talk about this issue – but from what we have heard from them so far, they are saying they are committed to working with the Tahltan First Nation; they are committed to removing contaminated water from drill sites – why aren’t these assurances enough?

McPHAIL: Well, if we take a look at history, the only history that we have to go on is that of Coal Bed Methane. And Coal Bed Methane, in and of itself, has a very terrible track record. The Province of BC and Shell Canada have never commercially produced Coal Bed Methane. So to bring an experiment like that into where we have the world’s largest population of Osbourne Cariboo, a red-listed species that our hunting and guiding outfitting community depends upon – to say that OK, we have never done this before, we going to assure you that we are going to do it right – again, it offers very little comfort.

BOWERS: All right. Shannon, thanks for your perspective this morning. We appreciate it.

McPHAIL: Thanks, too.

BOWERS: All the best.

McPHAIL: Bye.

BOWERS: Sharon – er, Shannon McPhail is Executive Director of the Skeena Watershed Conservation Society. As I mentioned, we have requested an interview with Shell Canada: we are hoping to have them on the programme tomorrow. In the meantime, we would like to hear about Coal Bed Methane exploration in BC. Do you feel like Shannon feels – that it doesn’t have any sort of economic benefit, or real economic benefit, to the region? Or do you think that it is a resource and BC should be getting what it can out of it? Call us up on the Listener Line: 1-866-340-1932. That’s 1-866-340-1932.

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